When you are near the end of the runway, quickly activate then detach them to get the nose pointing up. 2 will usually do nicely, but 3 or 4 are usually better (but of course heavier, and this tutorial assumes you use 2). Increasing the number of intakes will not allow you to continue using your jet engines at higher altitudes. Note: The large delta wing will ensure you won't backflip. One idea I haven't noticed here yet: "wire up" the landing gear, with strut connectors. To maximize lift, your aircraft should rest on the ground with the fuselage tilted upward at anywhere up to a 25-27 angle so that the wings will end up tilted back at up to 30. These should be in the bottom left next to the display of the cost of the aircraft. As such, don't use control surfaces as substitutes for wings, and don't use more control surfaces than you need. Re-entry heating can destroy parts of your spaceplane, or destroy it entirely. Now for wings, the "Wing Connector Type B" is the largest you have so far; connect a set of those where the centre of mass is. [KSP] - Heavy Seaplane Take-off, Water-landing and Re-take-off! With initial passes, you start off with a periapsis at 50-60 km and gradually lower your apoapsis until you're in an almost circularized low orbit and then transition to your usual re-entry approach. To takeoff and land at low speed, it's helpful to rotate the wings so the leading edge is slightly above the trailing edge. Mechjeb Spaceplane Guidance : r/KerbalSpaceProgram - reddit KSP short takeoff plane test | Simple Horten Ho 229 replica Having landing gears near the front and back of your aircraft can also help to ensure that you won't break your engines or smash your cockpit into the runway. If, instead, all goes well, then once your jet engines have shut down you will need to start the second part of your space mission by switching to rockets. I have doubled the max stress value for aerodynamics failure in FAR for every category. Or adding a RATO boosters. Bit late i know, but i had the same problem. Now imagine what happens like that. You want to start by attaching a Mk 0 Liquid Fuel Tank under the wings, making sure you're mirrored so it goes under both wings. Plane wobble during takeoff - Kerbal Space Program Forums What you ought to be using is the Swept Wings and Elevon 1s instead of the Delta-Deluxe Winglets. To survive re-entry, it's recommended to start your approach back into the atmosphere at a shallow angle, ideally with a periapsis of around 30-35 km. A good example of this is at the KSC runway when landing on a 90 degree bearing. A relatively low-drag alternative is to use an inverted cargo bay and some hydraulic cylinders with structural panels as a cargo elevator. and our There are several forces in Kerbal Space Program which have an effect on the flight characteristics of SSTO craft. the I place on the wing and attach landing gear on those, it sometimes takes a few tries to find the right spot but well worth it. Because of how small Kerbin is and how high its gravity is, a perfectly flat surface just north of the equator will cause planes taking off to bias to the right of the runway, as if they were rolling downhill. However, it's not a matter of "atmosphere or not", just a matter of air pressure which decreases rapidly with altitude. The issue is my plane rolls very sharply to the left any time I pitch up. everytime i make a powered plane, it always flips over and points backwards after i take off. In an aircraft with two or more engines, this can potentially cause you to enter a flat spin which can be unrecoverable if your center of mass is behind your center of lift. Before you can make a successful plane, you must understand what makes a plane go in places other than the ground - the wings. Go on, and take the plane capsule which looks like a converted fuel storage device. I made this aircraft based on real life commercial jet design. Be warned that if you do not provide sufficient air intakes for the engines you've placed, you may find that some of your engines shut down before others. I wanted to develop a plane to check how are the aerodynamics physics working, and went back to the KSC VAB to design a little plane. This is all right if their high efficiency saves enough fuel, but that may not be the case in small spaceplanes with limited fuel capacity. Your plane is almost finished. When flying straight the plane is pretty stable but pitching up causes a sharp roll and I cant figure out why. Suggest a Correction Copyright 2023 Nexstar Media Inc. All rights reserved. All trademarks are property of their respective owners in the US and other countries. All you need to do is add landing gear (one right before the cockpit, and two on the tips or middle of the wings), and you're done! It can be helpful to use a slightly taller front landing gear and slightly shorter rear landing gears so that your fuselage points slightly upward on the ground, thereby increasing the angle of attack of your wings while on the ground. (Yes, you personally, you lucky thing! For more information, please see our Valve Corporation. LV-N "Nerv" nuclear thermal rockets are commonly used on SSTOs for the rocket stage if Rapiers are not used. Quick context, I am a software engineer. This would indicate two problems. For your first flight, it may be easiest to ignore yaw altogether and just maneuver by rolling slightly and pitching. By accepting all cookies, you agree to our use of cookies to deliver and maintain our services and site, improve the quality of Reddit, personalize Reddit content and advertising, and measure the effectiveness of advertising. You may also want to deploy your landing gears to increase your drag, as well as airbrakes if you have them. You can post now and register later. 1. make sure your main gear is not wobbling (ie. Ideally, you ought to test landing the spaceplane with full fuel tanks and with nearly empty fuel tanks prior to taking your spaceplane to orbit. This is also the same reason why planes start rolling toward the middle of the runway; because both ends of the runway are further from . My Space Plane Keeps Flipping Backwards On The - Dive into anything They all had to use the runway drop to take off. 1. tilt of the plane. Just after having taken off, the plane will immediately start rolling to the right, and completely uncontrollably. - KSP Matt Lowne 527K subscribers 1.3M views 2 years ago I've wanted. Firstly you're going to want to make a short fuselage. So yesterday I was playing some KSP2, and resumed the game from a save where I had landed in Duna. . Now I'll walk you through a basic aircraft; fancy stuff like science equipment can be added later. You can post now and register later. Center of Mass and Center of Lift are the usual causes of instability. To slow down faster, you can increase the braking strength of your rear wheels. KSP 2 speculation: I believe terraforming will be a feature of the game. Alternatively, if you're returning from a high orbit or from an interplanetary trip, you can try repeated shallow passes through the atmosphere. FAA investigating 'close call' between planes at Boston airport https://wiki.kerbalspaceprogram.com/index.php?title=Tutorial:_Your_First_Plane&oldid=103052. You should have something called an "Elevon 1"; this will be the moving part for your wings. Tutorial:Aeris 4A mission - Kerbal Space Program Wiki So you want to make a plane but all your contraptions explode on the runway, crash into the runway a few seconds after taking off, crash into the side of the runway, crash into the ocean after doing a tight turn or otherwise fail to do what you intended? Symmetry placement should give you perfect symmetry, as far as the game is concerned. Install S5 moon rocket By lightbreaker_64. You can also use parachutes on landing, but care must be taken to ensure that an adequate length of runway remains since you'll only get one chance to use them. (Idea is moot, if you haven't unlocked them yet.) The Mk1 fuselage parts only tolerate up to 2000K, while Mk2 fuselages tolerate up to 2500K, and Mk3 fuselages tolerate up to 2700K. This is either a collider or design issue, if the craft doesn't have enough lift initially to get off the ground it will bounce a bit before taking off. If your Mk3 design jam-packed full of heavy gear can't seem to survive reentry, one option might be to reduce the payload a bit. my planes keep flipping backwards on take off : r/KerbalAcademy - reddit The only drawback to the reduced friction is reduced steering control, so this setting may need to be adjusted when taxiing to/from a runway, but should otherwise be kept minimal for takeoff and landing. If you have seen the examples above, I have planes that have angled landing gear and they work perfectly, yet some planes with straight landing gears don't. When your altitude reaches 35km, start pulling up gently. Powered by Invision Community. These have an ISP of 800 in a vacuum which is significantly better than all other rocket motors except the very weak IX-6315 ion rocket. They could go up to 120 m/s on the runway and still not lift up. I scoured the entire web for a solution, but found no working solution or at least dont work every time. This is generally an issue of not spacing your landing gears out far enough apart. Otherwise, you can either shift your wings till it's right (though this may crowd them near the back), or you can very slightly rotate the big wings so they're slightly higher near the front of the plane. Though, I use the FAR mod which will change things, so I can't guarantee the results will be useful, but it might be interesting. However, make sure to use struts when placing landing gears on the far edges of a multi-part wing because they may sag enough to cause a fuselage collision with the runway during landing. I removed them and it works fine now. Not sure why you would want that stability for speeds in excess of 200 m/s though, as most planes will take off and land at far slower speeds. This allows you to avoid the extra weight and mass of additional fuselage parts, so you only have to deal with the extra weight of the fuel itself. For heavy rockets, it might be required to use structure to space the gears away from the body to allow more pitch. Besides the good advice others have given, I would also be very careful with that little tailwheel. Check out the following guide for some good info: Your wheel base is the problem. So I have played the game for 200 hours and I love it. https://wiki.kerbalspaceprogram.com/index.php?title=Tutorial:_Basic_Plane_Design&oldid=97453, In the front of the plane - In this position, the control surfaces are also known as , In the back of the plane, on the tail - The most usual position; usually, close to the rudder. You can deploy your chutes just prior to touchdown for rapid deceleration. Your very own tutorial.). One final point to consider is the mass you're planning to store in the fuselage. This thread is archived . If that's not an option, you can still recover some value by landing at any suitable flat place on Kerbin. - Make sure you have enough control authority to lift the nose up. That, combined with a Unity joint bug, makes your plane bounce. Note that canards are somewhat more efficient than horizontal tail fins since canards provide an upward force with upward rotation, and downward force with downward rotation. A Ravenspear Mk3 taking off from the Runway in version 1.0.5. These have extremely poor temperature tolerance and will almost inevitably break up during atmospheric reentry. @TheEnvironmentalist There is one more method I'm sure would work in your case, although I didn't write about it because I think it's cheesy and wouldn't solve the root problem. Unstable Aircraft: "FAR Firehound" (Stock). Angled landing gear create rotational force for whatever reason. Do you have new pics after you moved the rear wheels forward? KSP v.22 Takeoff Troubleshooting Guide/Tutorial Lots of info to help get your plane off the runway! This is also the same reason why planes start rolling toward the middle of the runway; because both ends of the runway are further from the center of Kerbin than the middle (because it's totally flat), the runway is a valley from a gravitational frame of reference. 2022 Take-Two Interactive Software, Inc. So if I start encountering wobble it's time to pull back on the stick and get in the air. When dealing with high-speed landings, you may touch down too quickly and cause the front of the plane to smack into the runway. If your rear wheels are too far back the aircraft will not be able to pivot on the wheels and lift its nose up. Mk2 aircraft may be able to get away with it, but even then it's often best to space them further out. It is also advisable to add some control surfaces to your plane to have some control in the atmosphere: you can manually add them to the wings or choose winglets with effective control surfaces, like the Standard Canard. if mounted on not struted part). my center of lift is always slightly infront of my mass. Note that most air intakes tend to produce less drag than aerodynamic nose cones and pointy cockpits, especially shock cone intakes. However it's huge size can make it tricky to take off from the runway without destroying the engine. Hello, I am having a small problem with a plane I have built. It's a prolem enough I have sever differen gear subassemblies that are stable (un wobbly) I can then position depending on COM. Your wings provide the lift, and they cant provide lift if your wheels are too far back because then your base is to stable and the craft wont pivot upwards. Landing speed (minimum speed for level flight) can be reduced by adding components to increase maneuverability, by using larger wings, by increasing wing angle of attack on the fuselage (3-5 degrees is the recommended range for a spaceplane to achieve the best lift-to-drag ratio [source]), and by decreasing the weight of the aircraft. Vice versa a plane with lots of control surfaces will be perfectly controllable (maybe even too much) but may have big difficulties with taking off and landing at reasonable speeds. Tutorial:Basic SSTO Design - Kerbal Space Program Wiki Having said all that, these are the issues you must contend with. Espaol - Latinoamrica (Spanish - Latin America), http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=484107795, http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=484107807, http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=484107735, http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=484107761, http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=484119427, http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/52080-Basic-Aircraft-Design-Explained-Simply-With-Pictures, http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=484137556, http://images.akamai.steamusercontent.com/ugc/443953434412162923/42B3BB54A6A524CCC2E5C102AD88C8E521790F55/. If your spaceplane is able to fly and land steadily at low speeds but just you're having difficulty slowing down as you approach the runway, try to reach your desired speed first and then approach the runway in almost level flight. At around . An alternative is making sure you have complete control of the craft. T-1 "Dart" engines are unique amongst conventionally-fuelled rocket engines: They have close to the highest efficiency in both vacuum and low atmosphere. Also note that for maximum efficiency, you should make sure that your horizontal control surfaces are rotated to exactly the same pitch that you've rotated your wings. This thread is quite old. * Gear not mounted to parts that will flex (e.g. You need to make sure that the Orange axis on the rotate sphere is parallel to your, nose-tail axis. (However, it must be noted that it is bad practice to use ailerons as elevators since it makes it hard to control the aircraft), The rudder moves the tip of the plane left and right; it is rarely used, since it is hard to put it both up and down due to the possibility of hitting the ground. For this to happen, I'm assuming you're using rocket fuel tanks. I started investigating why this was happening. If you have a very short length of runway remaining and your parachutes can't slow you down fast enough, you'll be forced to cut the chutes and attempt a second landing without them. When your nose is stable at about 10 degrees above the horizon, pull up hard and keep it pulled. This makes them a very effective choice for SSTOs since they do a good job of getting maximum velocity out of air-breathing mode, and then allow you to use oxidizer without needing the added weight and drag of a separate rocket engine. Controllability of a plane is on you. (For test purposes, all aircraft are not pitched up and SAS is turned off. They all had to use the runway drop to take off. This helps to keep the performance of your spaceplane stable with any amount of fuel. mods used are OPT for most of the body and the front canards and tail plane, B9 procedural wings for the wings, and mk4 spaceplane parts for the engines. When your jet engines stop working, it is time to ignite the old, reliable liquid fuel engine. You're going to have a bad time. If you need to carry more fuel, consider using the Big-S Delta Wing as it provides the same lift-to-drag and lift-to-weight ratio as any other wing of the same mass, yet has the ability to carry fuel as well. Note that the lift rating does not mean that the wings will automatically lift a spaceplane into the air when it's moving forward. Cure: Draw a mental axis from the nose to the tail of the plane and use the rotate tool (summetry on), on one of the wheels. The same principle applies here. But I am still not sure if there are more reasons or perhaps it is just a physics bug which I am wasting my time on. This tutorial will help you with the basics of spaceplane flight, and will help you avoid the most common errors that could ruin your day as a spaceplane pilot! Close to empty tanks will allow you to fly slower, decelerate faster, and reduce touchdown strain. Here is the best aircraft I have created to date: Jet Aircraft. Your link has been automatically embedded. I don't have any mods but sometimes a problem may be a simple bug. For a Mk1-based aircraft, your rear landing gears should not be tightly tucked together on the fuselage. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Flying a Space Station through a GAS GIANT! While all other cargo bays are fine for making spaceplanes, the Mk3 Cargo Ramp produces obscene amounts of drag, which can easily prevent reaching orbital velocities by itself. These occur at their worst when your center of gravity is far ahead of your rear landing gears and you have a heavy plane at high speeds and a high angle of attack on landing, resulting in your front landing gear rapidly striking the runway after your rear landing gears touchdown. 2022 Take-Two Interactive Software, Inc. The rudder is mostly used when landing and when attempting to line up a shot (in a fighter plane). Also, excessive use of the rudder usually causes the plane to spin out of control and crash. Note that dropping off cargo from the back with a Mk3 Cargo Ramp is bad for more than one reason. Works well on small craft. See if there is still a problem when only travelling slowly, say <20m/s. Display as a link instead, An aircraft without control surfaces is like a rocket without RCS or reaction wheels - it will hardly turn and will be equally hard to control (perhaps even impossible!). This can turn into a fatal scenario if the center of mass gets behind the center of lift and you enter a flat spin. I checked my planes and I found the problem. When gear is placed, it has just one point of attachment. If you are using B9 Rocketery or other parts that utilize Firesplitter, this is normal. KSC's runway is slightly north of Kerbin's equator and perfectly flat. Now right click each elevon and the tail fin and set what movement each controls; the ones on the large wings control roll only, the ones on the back wings control pitch only, and the tail fin controls yaw only. In subsequent missions, you may want to launch with less fuel to cut down on cost and make landing a quicker and easier process. Create an account to follow your favorite communities and start taking part in conversations. Here is an example of landing gear place on a complex geometric surface: Unstable plane Rear landing gears only seems to work on cylindrical fuselage, if you place them on a fuselage intake or anything other than a cylinder, the wheels can behave strangely. Does your plane never pull up taking off? I have been building - reddit For all your gaming related, space exploration needs. Or maybe launching it in a vertical, Space Shuttle-style config. If you're planning on landing on a somewhat uneven surface, like an open grassland somewhere on Kerbin or an island on Laythe, consider packing some parachutes for deceleration. The most dangerous part of a spaceplane flight is returning from orbit. I took off and at 60 m/s I was in the air! You probably won't have much luck landing the fuselage intact if your Mk3 plane gets its wings scorched off on reentry. Keep your spaceplane pointed about 90 degrees above prograde so that the wings and body of your aircraft slow you down as much as possible. All of them had one thing in common though. I also used Intake build aid to balance the intakes. When landing, you can achieve the highest lift for a given speed by raising the total angle of attack of your wings to 30 degrees (although this induces a great deal of drag). A control surface with 100% control surface portion will weigh twice as much as a wing with the same lift would weigh. Real planes do this as well. This thread is quite old. But also check to make sure that your wheels are placed symmetrically and your engines are aligned properly. Either one of those being misaligned will cause instability on the runway during takeoff (and the engines misaligned will cause flight problems). Valve Corporation. Similar principles apply when finding suitable landing sites away from the KSC. To avoid swerving on takeoff and landing, it is strongly recommended to turn off or reduce the strength of the front brake on your aircraft, as well as to reduce the friction control. Keep at around 15 degrees to allow the plane to accelerate past 1000m/s. It's strongly recommended to keep your landing gears well-spaced from each other to ensure that the aircraft will be difficult to roll into a collision. Be aware that landing on water is an option if your spaceplane can fly level at less than ~40-50 m/s. Let it get good and clear of the ground before applying any control to it. Privacy Policy. I just thought my planes were too heavy or not enough control surfaces. Thanks for the help guys. I thought after buying this I would have all the parts I need to build a small plane that can at least get off the ground, but I'm having trouble. Descending greater than -10 m/s usually makes a mess. If your spaceplane is difficult to land when full of fuel but easy to land when empty, then it may be helpful to burn off or transfer out most of the excess fuel before landing to make the aircraft lighter. Clear editor. Drive gently off the runway and use the huge grassy field to take off, without care in the world about the plane veering to a side. 1. make sure your main gear is not wobbling (ie. https://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/index.php?/topic/124380-wing-lift-amp-wing-lift-to-drag-ratio-charts/, https://wiki.kerbalspaceprogram.com/index.php?title=Tutorial:_Spaceplane_basics&oldid=100619. Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts. They all had landing gear placed at the front and at the back. If you plan on either dropping off cargo or picking up cargo and traveling with it, you'll generally want to locate your cargo bay at the middle of your center of gravity. Make sure that all of your landing gears are pointing in exactly the same direction. This aircraft handles smoothly, no matter how you turn, roll and flip this aircraft, it will never lose control. As you reach 100m/s, hold S to pull the stick back, and you should be in the air! I moved the back landing gear to right underneath the COM. I am definitely aware that there are multiple reasons as to why the plane flips. Also note that shock cone intakes appear to provide the best air supply at all mach speeds, and unlike other air intakes, they do not decline in performance beyond certain mach speeds. How to make aircraft take off - Kerbal Space Program Forums "Type E" is the smallest you should have, and you want a set of those connected at the back of the fuselage. I feel tat it is either due to the symmetry placement in this game being inaccurate or certain parts where i anchor my landing gears on are not perfectly symmetrical and the physics calculation is just too sensitive about even the slightest misalignment. Then you want to put something called a "Small Circular Intake" on the front of the tank, and a "J-20 Juno" engine on the back of the tank. here are some images and a gif. I made a KSP replica of the Horten Ho 229 while trying to make a short takeoff plane.If you have any questions or suggestions, let me know in the comments.My. Note that when your jet engines shut down simultaneously while climbing in otherwise normal flight, it is generally due to a lack of pressure from the altitude you're flying at. Hit the launch button and watch your magnificent bird fly! That will align with the craft axis. You should be able to navigate fairly readily, and with the superb efficiency of jet engines, you should have plenty of fuel to go anywhere you need to go. Note: This is ONLY to be used to report spam, advertising, and problematic (harassment, fighting, or rude) posts. If rear landing gear are strutted together, or braced to a center point, they are less likely to torque in different directions. 2022 Take-Two Interactive Software, Inc. However, they are extremely heavy for their power, weighing as much as a conventional rocket nearly 11 times more powerful. Your previous content has been restored. It provides a wider, more stable wheel base while keeping the wheels straight up and down (no camber). Cookie Notice By rejecting non-essential cookies, Reddit may still use certain cookies to ensure the proper functionality of our platform. mods used are OPT for most of the body and the front canards and tail plane, B9 procedural wings for the wings, and mk4 . Thanks for all the help. as Shkeec said check gear check gear check gear. If you're tired of big rockets that use tons of fuel and disintegrate in the atmosphere when coming back to Kerbin, this tutorial is perfect for you! . This is just a general briefing section with lots of "to do" or "not to do" things: when you think you've got it, check the Aeris 4A tutorial mission to learn how to get into space easily. DO NOT ANGLE THEM! Do you have a screenshot of the craft? The problem could be due to several issues. Then at the top, we'll put one tail fin, centred on the end of the fuselage. Ailerons to roll your aircraft should be placed as far off to the edges of your wings as possible. 4. Also avoid the basic fin for the same reason. If you keep all of the fuel in the front, you may find that your center of mass drifts backwards as your fuel drains. I have found a solution to my problem. Check out the following guide for some good info: http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/52080-Basic-Aircraft-Design-Explained-Simply-With-Pictures Keep in mind that lift rating and control surfaces are not connected: lift rating is basically the capacity of your wings to sustain the weight of your spaceplane, while control surfaces are parts of wing that can be moved to change the flow of the air around the plane and through this change a plane's direction, angle of attack or inclination. I have created a score of other aircrafts with different designs but deleted them because they didnt work even on the runway. Aim to get your speed below 50m/s, and have plenty of water ahead of you; keep the plane level, and pitch up to shed velocity. Go on, and take the plane capsule which looks like a converted fuel storage device Contents 1 Making a fuselage 2 Understanding Lift 3 Control Surfaces 3.1 Elevator 3.2 Aileron 3.3 Rudder 4 Landing gear Making a fuselage Any plane needs speed - so you need thrust (usually). And also place them further apart.
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